Filtering out hot break before fermentation?

Sat Apr 20, 2013 2:53 pm

I'm listening to the Session and they're talking about ways to drop hot break out of solution prior to fermentation. Doc first uses an immersion chiller and once the wort is chilled, he says the hot break falls to the bottom of the boil kettle, and then he uses a counterflow chiller. Tasty uses a whirlpool and then I believe some kind of plate chiller. After the wort is in his conical, he'll drop the hot break from the bottom of the cone prior to adding yeast. I've never heard of doing stuff like this. You can't argue with results, but is all of this necessary? Can you not ferment and then leave the trub in the bottom of the fermenter when transferring to the keg? Is there an advantage to fermenting with no hot break? :? If there is a problem with leaving hot break in the fermenter, I have a hopback that I never use. Would it be reasonable to hook up the hopback on the cool side of the counterflow chiller to filter out hot break? Should I even bother? Brewinhard, where are you?
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BeaverBarber
 
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Re: Filtering out hot break before fermentation?

Sat Apr 20, 2013 7:01 pm

BeaverBarber wrote:You can't argue with results, but is all of this necessary? Can you not ferment and then leave the trub in the bottom of the fermenter when transferring to the keg? Is there an advantage to fermenting with no hot break? :?

excellent question. in an attempt to leave the cold break behind, i tried whirpooling for the first time today... failed miserably. i need to know if this is really worth it before going through that again...
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sweetcell
 
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Re: Filtering out hot break before fermentation?

Sun Apr 21, 2013 8:19 am

sweetcell wrote:
BeaverBarber wrote:You can't argue with results, but is all of this necessary? Can you not ferment and then leave the trub in the bottom of the fermenter when transferring to the keg? Is there an advantage to fermenting with no hot break? :?

excellent question. in an attempt to leave the cold break behind, i tried whirpooling for the first time today... failed miserably. i need to know if this is really worth it before going through that again...

It might just be something that commercial brewers do for yeast repitching purposes.
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Re: Filtering out hot break before fermentation?

Mon Apr 22, 2013 2:55 pm

less trub (hot break/cold break) in a fermenter will lead to cleaner tasting beers (especially lagers). Do be aware that the yeast will use some of these proteins during their growth phase (minimal amounts). A whirlpool can help to coagulate the trub into the center of the boil kettle before transferring to a fermenter. A conical would be the most efficient way of doing this, but alas I am not that cool!

I think I remember Tasty saying he used to use his hopback filled with rice hulls to filter out the trub left from his boil before running the wort through his plate chiller. So you could always give that a try, maybe pm him and see what he recommends.

I just do a simple whirlpool, then rack clean wort from above any hot/cold break material left in the kettle into my fermenter. Works fairly well, but honestly, I don't worry about some trub getting into my fermenter. I have bigger fish to fry (ie a quick brew day before my 3 yr old daughter and 3 mos old son start whooping it up!)....
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Re: Filtering out hot break before fermentation?

Mon Apr 22, 2013 3:16 pm

brewinhard wrote:yeast will use some of these proteins during their growth phase (minimal amounts)


Minimal amounts being that if you can see it, you've already got way too much. Get as much out as you possibly can & you'll still have more than enough. I don't think it's the proteins they're after though. I'm drawing a blank, but it has something to do with sterols. Glycogen perhaps?

brewinhard wrote:I think I remember Tasty saying he used to use his hopback filled with rice hulls to filter out the trub


Empty hop sacks were his recommendation. I don't recall if he was thinking out loud or if he actually did it. This is 90% of the reason I've got a Hop Rocket on my list of upgrades. I just got my big kettle in today, the whirlpool arm is installed & I decided that between a built-in whirlpool and a dual purpose hopback, I took the Hop Blocker off the list.

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Re: Filtering out hot break before fermentation?

Mon Apr 22, 2013 6:14 pm

Thanks all. I think I'll just hook up the hopback on the cold side of the counterflow and see how things come out. It's only a little more work, and I'll filter with whole hops. I've never had much luck with light lagers. I'll give it a shot this weekend on a light lager and see what happens. Thanks again,

Mike
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Re: Filtering out hot break before fermentation?

Mon Apr 22, 2013 6:34 pm

Ozwald wrote:This is 90% of the reason I've got a Hop Rocket on my list of upgrades. I just got my big kettle in today, the whirlpool arm is installed & I decided that between a built-in whirlpool and a dual purpose hopback, I took the Hop Blocker off the list.

:wink:

Oh, and Oz, you probably already know this because I sense that you're pretty resourceful, but I bought a March pump for my hopback and counterflow set up and it's turned out to be a $150 door stop. I never use it because everything seems to gravity feed just fine. I know you've probably already got a pump for your whirlpool, but if you do buy a hop back, from my experience, you can keep the cost way down by eliminating the pump.
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Re: Filtering out hot break before fermentation?

Mon Apr 22, 2013 7:11 pm

BeaverBarber wrote:Thanks all. I think I'll just hook up the hopback on the cold side of the counterflow and see how things come out. It's only a little more work, and I'll filter with whole hops. I've never had much luck with light lagers. I'll give it a shot this weekend on a light lager and see what happens. Thanks again

Mike


Be carefull on the cold side as I'm sure you know. Sanitation is key. Good luck. I have a HopRocket and run all my beers thru it before the plate chiller; even if it is full of rice hulls.

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